[Beat The Fish]

I don't believe much in telling bad beat stories, but I had an interesting run last night. I played some small-ish games on Bodog and ended up ahead about $370 within an hour. However, my attention span has been low as of late so I opened up Doyle's Room as well.

I was doing okay but within the course of 2 hours I had 2 sets of Queens, a set of Kings, and a set of 8s beaten by a flush draw on the river. Four times I hit the set and four times they drew the flush on the river. Twice it was the same guy!

I'm making up for it now on a $5/10 shorthanded game, but that was brutal last night! I'm not telling you this simply to comiserate but to try to give you a lesson from a couple of my mistakes. Two of those hands I played right and the guy simply went against the odds and get lucky, but the other couple I simply didn't bet enough on the flop. So, take my advice and bet huge when you see those two suited cards on the flop.

I have been doing really well at the Doyle's Room ring games lately, but you have to keep in mind how poorly these guys will play. If they're willing to put in all their money to draw on you, there's nothing you can do and you played it right. However, when something like this happens it is a good opportunity to analyze your play and figure out if you could have done anything better.

[cuuzi]

Must've been very frustrating

[ahar010]

When playing against a flush draw. I find it literally impossible to push someone off it on the flop. They are 2.5 ish to 1 to hit it if i'm correct?

I've found it easier to make a small bet that i'm comfortable with to keep the pot building, and see the turn. If the flush hits and then fold the hand or stay in cheaply. If it doesn't then push hard. They only have a single card left now. All but the "luckiest" of poker players will fold then. And if they don't they are now only 5:1 to hit, so you'll get sucked out on less.

Not sure if my strategy is a good idea or not. Probably some big flaws in it. But i really did get sick of poeple hitting the flush on the river.

Maybe i'm missing out on the big pots when they don't hit though??

[jslavi01]

Pushing people off of flush draws is kinda tricky. In cash games, don't be afraid to pot the flop, and then pot the turn if a blank comes, and you think they have a flush draw.

Also, remember, you are supposed to lose to that draw 20% of the time, no matter how much you bet.

In this case what you optimally want to do is raise get those hands out. Win the pot right there. Absolutely do not give them the odds to draw.

[Beat The Fish]

I feel sort of embarassed that this thread was revived after 6 months as I'm trying to get out of the habit of telling bad beat stories.

Anyway, as I feel like I've grown as a poker player and have had some of my best results ever over the past 2 months, I've adapted my response about opponent flush draws to "it depends" on the situation at hand. If you're playing with a bunch of maniacs who will call a bit bet with flush draws then, by all means, get the most value out of it and keep betting the pot on the turn.

However, if you're talking about strictly not giving your opponents the proper odds to draw to an open-ended straight or flush draw, anything of half the pot or better will be a mistake for your opponents to call. While you often hear the 2-1 odds quotes for making a flush by the river, that includes 2 betting rounds. Obviously, you'll be betting again on the turn if the draw doesn't hit so your opponent actually is getting worse than 4-1 odds on hitting it on the next card.

If your opponents are tight and/or better players, you don't have to make huge bets against draws. This is especially true on the turn where the pot will probably already be significant. There was a time when I would say always bet the heck out of it if you suspect you're up against a draw, but many times you don't need to do this and it can cost you value against calling stations or tighter players. However, like I mentioned earlier, if you feel strongly that your opponent will call large bets on draws you should certainly go for it.

On a final note on the subject, if you're acting first and the draw misses on the river, you HAVE TO check. There is absolutely no reason to bet into a suspected busted draw. If you bet, he obviously can't call. He may occasionally try the bluff raise, but you'll see that rarely. However, if you make a hesitant check, many time you'll induce a bluff. This is the only way your opponent knows he can win the hand so he either has to give up or bluff. I can't tell you how many times I've happily faced an all-in bluff by a busted flush draw.

...

Okay, maybe I'll tell one more bad beat story. Last night I was playing a $2/4 NL game with about $350 after a couple of hours of play. I picked up pocked Aces in the big blind and re-raised a late position raiser to $40 after he raised to $12. He calls and the flop is Js-4h-5h. I check-raised his $50 bet all-in. He thinks and thinks before finally calling with Ad-Jc for a pot of just over $700. The turn is a 7h and I've got the Ah. The river, however, is the Jd and he immediately leaves the table. That was the ONLY card he could have hit as the Jh would still have given me the winning flush. The hand played out EXACTLY how I wanted it, but the ending didn't. Too bad...